Anarchist Discussion Forums

Satanists always claim that they're just about being liberated from religion or whatever and freedom but what they're really into is romanticizing and promoting evil. The fact that a character named Satan doesn't exist is a strawman that they use to obfuscate this truth. The ritual murders and all that stuff, it's nothing good. And we all believe in good and evil obviously or we wouldn't give a fuck about most of the stuff we talk about. I mean I'm not the type of person that freaks out if someone makes the horn symbol or something minor like that, or even if you're into heavy metal music or whatever. But if you call yourself a Satanist most likely you're an ammoral person who's into black magick and the occult just like people in the ruling class like the Skull & Bones members.

[quote="cat~maxwell"]how many of your 'komrades' think it's cool tosay 'hail satan; and show off inverted pentacles and 666 tatts at hardcore shows? the answe ris a LOT of them.

they are enemies of anarchism, you must understand.... etc. Bush families etc. etc.[/quote]

Well, I quite disagree, I wouldn't generalize like that.

Satanism is not exclusivelly "conservative" or "reactionary" or "fascist" or "opposed to anarchism" etc.
Many people can have both satanic and anarchist worldviews totally compatibile with each other, but I think it depends how they percieve satanism itself or are they anarchists whatsoever.

Thelema actually seems pretty damn anarchistic in many ways.

[quote]personally i found the 'do what thou wilt' aspect of satanism very helpful. you can't spend your life expecting others to do the right thing, or you get screwed over far too often.[/quote]
To help one misconception out: Aleister Crowley IS NOT a Satanist.
His writings might contain some satanic knowledge, but most of his occult works are barely related to that philosophy.

"As Alan Watts once put it, 'Most people who call themselves Christian don't practice the religion of Christ, they practice a religion about Christ - which is of course not the same thing'."

anyone here read the Dead sea Scrolls?

personally i found the 'do what thou wilt' aspect of satanism very helpful. you can't spend your life expecting others to do the right thing, or you get screwed over far too often.

As Alan Watts once put it, 'Most people who call themselves Christian don't practice the religion of Christ, they practice a religion [i]about[/i] Christ - which is of course not the same thing'.

I went through a 'Satanist' phase that lasted about 6 months when I was in my late teens, but I then moved on to the works of Aleister Crowley which seemed much more conducive to making progress in my life at that time, and also a bit more intellectually robust, especially with its grounding in yoga. The Satanism didn't seem so relevant when I left the home of my vaguely Catholic upbringing and got out into the real post-Christian world. Satanism may be more relevant and useful in the USA where religion still holds real and potent power in politics and the lives of people.

For anyone unfamiliar with Crowley:

Liber Jugorum & Liber E. You may want to try the excercises out of curiosity.
http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib3.html
http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib9.html

The Book of the Law
http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/engccxx.html

Eight Lectures on Yoga
http://www.hermetic.com/crowley/yoga/index.html

[quote="Francois Tremblay"]Saying "war is peace" is a deliberate act to mislead people and confuse them. [/quote]

except when one is invoking newspeak to show irony, or even for humor, such as when Marja said:

[quote]I think Christianity had already filled the niche of the exact opposite of Christianity.[/quote]

Saying "war is peace" is a deliberate act to mislead people and confuse them. This fact implies that one is very conscious that they are not in fact similar at all.

[quote="Francois Tremblay"]
How can something be its opposite?[/quote]

lol, a little of the old "A and not A can never be valid" eh, Francois?

surely you've heard of newspeak - war is peace, freedom is slavery, ignorance is strength, etc.

when it comes to church and state, only the contradictory can be 'true.' :)

there are people who call themselves "christian" because they've read some of the supposed words of a (semi-)mythical person commonly referd to as 'christ.' what the 'christ' said was often contradictory, so these people ignore the bad stuff and accept the good - al the while calling themselves christian. so i don't think that all christians should be lumped together as bad guys. weak minded, yed, but bad, no.

turn the other cheek, then overturn the tables in the temple. and that's just one 'man' (depending on the council of nicea).

Yea, but those contradictions are already contained within the Bible. It's possible to find a sect that believes the opposite of any other on any topic, I would think.

I mean that established Christianity can directly contradict the beliefs of the earliest Christians and/or of dissident Christians today.

One classic example is the use of the letter to the Romans to justify the state; it was once used to condemn participation in the state. A shift from absolute nonviolence to the crusader mentality. A shift from "be not unequally yoked" to defending patriarchy. A shift from Matthew 19:12 and Acts 8 to defending heteronormativity. A shift from Galatians 3:28 to outright nationalism. A shift from Philemon to defending slavery, and only later condemning it. A shift from "firstborn of all creation" to the Nicene Creed. A call to "love your neighbor as yourself," all too often gets combined with hatred of one's self or hatred of one's neighbors, in the name of one or another cause.

One could condemn [i]almost[/i] every implication of established Christianity, on Christian grounds. Not theism itself, but still...

I know religion is irrational. But even something irrational cannot be its opposite. A racist cannot also be anti-racist. A statist cannot be an Anarchist.

[quote="Francois Tremblay"][quote="Marja"]... I think Christianity had already filled the niche of the exact opposite of Christianity.[/quote]

How can something be its opposite?[/quote]

Religion can be contradictory and illogical because it's not about rationality it's about what people believe and feel.

[quote="Marja"]... I think Christianity had already filled the niche of the exact opposite of Christianity.[/quote]

How can something be its opposite?