anti-playboy and girl!!!!

[Yarrow]

um no?

sorry, i don't understand what you're refuting marja. i'll try rereading.

[Marja]

The quote got screwed up. I was questioning your claim that:

the male of the species controls his sexual drives through the cortex (unlike the female, who uses the sex hormones)

[Maithuna69]

And how exactly do you define 'control'?

I don't 'control' my need to defacate, I only control where, when and how I act upon that need. The need itself remains hardwired into the system, like the sex drive. I control where, when and how I act upon that need, but the need remains and serves its own purpose rather than mine.

[Francois Tremblay]

I don't 'control' my need to defacate, I only control where, when and how I act upon that need. The need itself remains hardwired into the system, like the sex drive. I control where, when and how I act upon that need, but the need remains and serves its own purpose rather than mine.

Why is it not "your purpose"? Where do you draw the line between yourself and not yourself?

[Maithuna69]

Perhaps I misuse the word 'purpose'. I refer to the blind evolutionary drive of genes to perpetuate themselves within the species, something that - on a personal level - I have no will to do with my own genes. The fact that I don't want to send my genes into the future doesn't remove the capacity or 'urge' of the genes themselves to do so, nor does it mean that I don't find myself subject to the biological drives which that urge entails, even though I may have no conscious awareness of it.

For example, I recall an interesting experiment conducted - I think - in Austria, in which scientists took full-length photographs and DNA swabs from female clubbers over an extended period. By comparing the photographs with the DNA, the scientists established that without exception , the girls who were showing the most exposed flesh in their outfits were at the peak point of their fertilty cycle. Talk of 'dressing to look good' and 'I dress for myself, not for men' may be consciously true, but this individual intent doesn't cancel out the millions of years of evolution that work away in our bodies without our conscious awareness. Anyway, I feel thread-drift coming on. Let us stick to the point!

[Yarrow]

control was the wrong word. i meant 'influenced by'.

but the masculine hormones (androgens) are produced in the cerebral cortex and are entirely OUT of a man's control (mental typo earlier, soz folks). female hormones (oestrogens) are produced by other hormones (the androgens, actually) and their production has been shown to be largely regulated by behaviour and other factors. a man appears to be driven to reproduce, whereas a woman has more choice in the matter. so they say.

[Francois Tremblay]

Genes have no purpose. Their only goal is to reproduce, not to reproduce the individual host. If their interest is better sought by having the host sacrifice itself for the sake of siblings, then that's what will be evolutionarily advantageous (see Hamilton's Rule).

[Marja]

control was the wrong word. i meant 'influenced by'.

but the masculine hormones (androgens) are produced in the cerebral cortex and are entirely OUT of a man's control (mental typo earlier, soz folks). female hormones (oestrogens) are produced by other hormones (the androgens, actually) and their production has been shown to be largely regulated by behaviour and other factors. a man appears to be driven to reproduce, whereas a woman has more choice in the matter. so they say.

Testosterone production is centered in the testes and the prostate.

[Maithuna69]

Seems to me we've gone off porn and drifted into biology. New thread, anyone?

[Francois Tremblay]

I agree.

[Yarrow]

before we do tho FT, who was talking about genes?

also, DHT affects us all more strongly than testo, and is produced in the cortex. i would go on but it's a heavy subject.

[Marja]

I was just saying, if you want to contrast male sexuality with female sexuality, the biology matters. And the production of DHT depends on the amount of T. If there's little T, there can't be much DHT.

I think the contrasts are overstated.

[Francois Tremblay]

I think we should stop talking about gender altogether. The fact is, in the view that there is a gradient between what we call "male" and "female," we don't know what they mean, or why we think there is a biological difference.

[Zazaban]

I think we should stop talking about gender altogether. The fact is, in the view that there is a gradient between what we call "male" and "female," we don't know what they mean, or why we think there is a biological difference.

[Yarrow]

whilst they are 2 extremes on a scale, i think we all know the differences. how many a person exemplifies (and how many are cultural constructs) is a different question.
personally i'm not the most male of males (i'd like to think i'm quite rational, i actively enjoy thinking, how many of these points are cultural? most i think) but i have no need for pornography. it's a hard thing to resist tho. but then so are sugary treats, or a position at the top of a multinational corp (i would imagine).
willpower is the key.