Antisemitism in anarchism?

[collectiveindividualist]

ah, how i do love my new firefox ignore-phpbb-poster extension.

now, do any non-mentally-ill people have something to say about this?

[|Y|]

You're justifying fucking "land right" by genetic ancestry. That's the most fucked up thing I've ever heard from you dude. BTW, I don't respond to you for you to necessarily read my response, I respond so others can know my position on this. If a newbie comes here and reads that pathetic "justification" they might mistakingly think that this is a position many anarchists have.

No one fucking has a "right to land" due to genetic ancestry or otherwise.

[collectiveindividualist]

does anyone who hasn't been diagnosed as schizophrenic have something to say about this? all compassion is due to those amoung us who are sick, but allowing sick people to disrupt an otherwise useful forum isn't acceptable either.

[jacobhaller]

You're justifying fucking "land right" by genetic ancestry. That's the most fucked up thing I've ever heard from you dude. BTW, I don't respond to you for you to necessarily read my response, I respond so others can know my position on this. If a newbie comes here and reads that pathetic "justification" they might mistakingly think that this is a position many anarchists have.

No one fucking has a "right to land" due to genetic ancestry or otherwise.

Agreed.

[collectiveindividualist]

Agreed.

hmmm jacob, i read the quote which you are agreeing to.

and that's hilarious.

ahem - WHO is making a claim of genetic history on the land?
WHO was actually LIVING on the land for 1200 years (use anyone? possesion anyone?)

the issue is that there is a group of people who are claiming the land. their reasons:

-the bible says it is ours (invalid, imho)
-we're originally from there (invalid and NOT TRUE)
-the holocaust means we should have it (even though we have to commit genocide to get it)

let me try to say it again: when ashkenazim say they are genetically from palestine they are not telling the truth. just like a peruvian indian isn't from ppalestine just because he/she converted to judaism. genetic "right" to the land wasn't even brought up by me - it's been brought up by the zionists to whom i am opposed!

it'd be cool if some of you would stop hating for a moment and actually READ what i am saying, but i wont hold my breath...

[|Y|]

Both Jews and Palestinan people were "recent immigrants" into the area. There is no truly good census data (both sides invoke some BS stuff), but certainly there would have been no room for the early Jewish and Arab immigrations if the place was packed, so clearly there had to have been a lot of room at the time (before the forced transplanting of Jewish settlers).

http://www.israelactivism.com/resources ... tsheet.asp

They're both a bunch of savages, and "ancestry data" no matter how you want to twist it cannot be used to "legitimize" ones occupation of a land (and thus, control over who else gets to live there). If the Jewish and Palestinian people were civilized there never would've been a problem. I pity neither party, and I say the best solution is to nuke Israel with a 6 month warning.

[jacobhaller]

Sorry. I figure, give the exiles their right of return, open the borders, and this crisis will go away. The east side of the Jordan valley was Palestinian, and the Zionists can probably finagle a way to transfer it from Hashemite control to Palestinian, which would simplify the right of return. But if there weren't any states involved, there wouldn't be any crisis either.

[|Y|]

The population of Israel has quintupled since the exiles left. It's impossible. Especially if we consider the decendents of the exiles themselves (we can assume that their population has doubled or even tripled since being exiled). We're talking about a land area more than 30 times smaller than Texas.

The only way they could return is if they were given a lot of wealth for returning. Good high rise housing, etc. Essentially making the cities in Israel much larger. No one is going to pay for such a thing, and in the end it still winds up being about wealth.

[Guest]

So if nobody has a genetic right to land colonialism is okay?

[|Y|]

No, what makes you think that? Possession is the key "right" to land. The people in Israel both have a right to the land. It's just that the more wealthy (the Jews) have more control over that land.

Israel could easily accomodate all of the people if it had big ass cities and better technology. But right now most of the Palestinians are poor and in the ruts. Not a good picture.

The problem is that when the Jews came to Israel there was a lot of land left. A lot of the Arabs left. They gave up possession because they were recent migrants themselves on the scheme of things (having only two generations there at most). What happened was a bunch of them decided to fight (rather than be sensible people and sit aound a table and discuss the migrations, remember, plenty of room). The Arabs "lost" and the clerics said "okay all Arabs let's leave." The Arabs like to listen to their goddamn clerics way too much. If I had a house there I wouldn't have left. And everyone could have got along peacefully if they only respected one another and one anothers religions.

Hell, the Palestinans might have even gained significant wealth by this point had they not had their petty wars and had the peaceful resolution. Unfortunately the elites never see the interest of the people at heart and call upon wars and bickering.