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Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Anarchism: What it is and what it is not.

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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby AndyMalroes » Sat Jan 16, 2010 10:58 pm

You have a terrible case of "lastwordism", you know that?

And yet you had to say the last word?
How long do you think we can have a free and democratic society if we insist on maintaining totalitarian systems in our companies? We must have freedom for individuals and organizations to grow and to realize their potentials.
(Delmar Landen, Head of Organisational Development at General Motors, 1981)
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Guest » Sun Jan 17, 2010 2:01 am

Me, me, me, me, me! I want the last word! I went to dictionary, com, yourdictionary.com, the free dictionary, merriam webster, cambridge advanced search, and google search, and just came up with all "word not found" for archist and archism. And yet it seems like a useful word meaning more than just statism, including hierarchies in the miitary with officers vs. men, with hierarchies within hierarchies, in government, in business with different levels of union bosses and management bosses, and in religion with a popes and ayatollahs down. I bet hierarchist is in the dictioanry, and that may be the word we have to settle for as the opposite of anarchist.
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Anarchological » Sun Jan 17, 2010 2:21 am

Most of those distionaries mentioned hierarchism, but only dictionary.com mentioned hierarchist, saying "hierarchist is a related form of hierarchism". Google dictionary had the longest defintion for hierarchism:


Hierarchism - A hierarchy is an arrangement of items (objects, names, values, categories, etc.), in which the items are represented as being "above," "below," or "at the same level as" one another. ...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hierarchism

hierarchism - The principles or authority of a hierarchy

en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hierarchism Starred words »
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby AndyMalroes » Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:09 am

LOL! Tom goes for the dictionary again! If only there were a nice slang Internet term to describe a person who, after being told a method of debate (in this case looking at the all-knowing, politically savvy and all together infallible book the dictionary) is invalid still spams forums with irrelevant junk such as "an'archism means no rulez so communism (rule by everybody in a sense) is incompatible." oh wait! How could I forget!?! Troll!
How long do you think we can have a free and democratic society if we insist on maintaining totalitarian systems in our companies? We must have freedom for individuals and organizations to grow and to realize their potentials.
(Delmar Landen, Head of Organisational Development at General Motors, 1981)
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Anarchological » Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:26 am

Any knowledge or opinions, Andy, about the issue at hand, or just ad hominem bullshit?
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby thelastindividual » Sun Jan 17, 2010 8:15 am

Anarchological wrote:Any knowledge or opinions, Andy, about the issue at hand, or just ad hominem bullshit?


That wasn't an Ad Hominem. Learn what an ad hominem is. Then fuck off back to mises.org.
"Well, judging by his outlandish attire, he's some sort of free thinking anarchist." - C.M Burns

"Property is theft right? Therefore theft is property. Therefore this ship is mine" - Zaphod Beeblebrox
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Anarchological » Sun Jan 17, 2010 9:28 am

It was all ad hominem, about the man, me in this case, not about the ideas.
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Anarchological » Sun Jan 17, 2010 9:36 am

I know you like to make up your own definitions as you go along, but this is from Dictionary.com, just for grins.

ad ho⋅mi⋅nem  /æd ˈhɒmənəm
–adjective 1. appealing to one's prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather than to one's intellect or reason.
2. attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his argument.
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby thelastindividual » Sun Jan 17, 2010 1:14 pm

In case you haven't noticed it was a critique of your ideas - that you get every bleeding one of them from the dictionary.
"Well, judging by his outlandish attire, he's some sort of free thinking anarchist." - C.M Burns

"Property is theft right? Therefore theft is property. Therefore this ship is mine" - Zaphod Beeblebrox
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Noa o `Anakia » Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:03 am

Sorry to jut in in the middle of a discussion...but...
I feel that yes, capitalism is compatible with anarchy, just it goes against the anarchist ideals of freedom and the abolition of tyrannical hiearchies. When websites claim capitalists cannot be anarchists, that seems a little extreme and false... but it seems capitalist anarchists cannot stand for freedom (since you are under the tyranny of corporations) and equality (because of capitalism's creation of class division).
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby Wally » Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:59 am

My first post here, just wanted to add my thoughts.

First of all the definition I use for capitalism is, the private ownership of the means of production. That being the "right", allowed by the state, for private individuals use their property economically by hiring wage labour, and profiting off that labour through surplus value created.

Socialism is the workers ownership of the means of production, however it is organised politically or socially.

Private property means 'economic' private property, not personal property. Something a lot of people are confused about.

Capitalism is not consistent with anarchism simply because capitalism creates an authority. The capitalist owner has authority over the worker. The private property owner has authority over the non-property owner (e.g. rent).
Private ownership means a small class of people monopolizing the means to produce, at the expense of the majority.
Capitalism keeps resources artificially scarce in order to maintain profits. Anarchism is about producing for our needs, everyone's needs.

Capitalism is liberty for capitalists. Liberty for some is not liberty for all.

Anarchism traditionally was socialist, and apposed to capitalism. Capitalism was the problem that socialism/anarchism was created to solve. Anarchism can be nothing but socialist because that is the only way for any kind of equality.

Capitalism, has always been the problem, more so than government. The early Anarchists, Bakunin etc., were more apposed to capitalism than government, because they new that the government we have is a result of the economic system we have. If the workers owned the means of production the state would lose it's power, and would eventually disappear altogether. The state/government gets it's power because of capitalism, because of the mass inequality of wealth. Money is the tool capitalists use to control, the state and you.

"Anarchism is stateless socialism" - Mikhail Bakunin

"Politically we are anarchists, and economically, communists or socialists." Adolph Fischer, Anarchism: Its Philosophy and Scientific Basis as Defined by Some of its Apostles (1887)
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Re: Capitalism *is* compatible with anarchism

Postby anarchostalinist » Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:06 pm

I have very panarchist leanings, and frankly I am not entirely unfriendly to the more anti-liberal and capitalist strains of anarchism. I don't even suppose it would be terrible. Think of it along the lines of an Amish lifestyle: yes, some people can't stand it; but for many people it's great.

I tend to lean more communist, but I can't say as I agree with Marxist objections to capitalism.
We say that every important branch of the economy must be built up on the principle of personal incentive. There must be collective discussion, but individual responsibility - V.I. Lenin
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